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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2020 7:19:01 GMT -5
Sorry. Not in the frame of mind to chase hidden meanings. If you have a point, make it. One must question laws created to solve problems that aren't really problems. The folks in Wisconsin may not agree with your needs "assessment", as they seem to keep returning the state legislature, the group responsible for this law, to Republican control.
Were one to review the history of Wisconsin state legislature, link it is clear it has been a fairly reliable Republican state, at least at the state level, with only two years in the last 28 that the Democrats held both Houses of the Legislature and the Governorship. The last time it occurred, the voters gave the state back to the Republicans for nearly a decade. If anything, voter fraud would have been being conducted by the Republicans and absent some sense that the registration validation only went to "certain" zip codes, this may well help the Democrats.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2020 9:02:09 GMT -5
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Post by stevez51 on Jan 16, 2020 9:10:19 GMT -5
The question should have been involving whistleblowers .......
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Post by soulflower on Jan 16, 2020 9:14:13 GMT -5
Schiff has been on TV more often than almost any member of Congress over the past 3 years.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2020 9:22:02 GMT -5
Schiff has been on TV more often than almost any member of Congress over the past 3 years. It doesn't mean people were watching or paying attention to him. Do you remember the name of the last used car salesman you saw on TV?
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Post by soulflower on Jan 16, 2020 9:47:30 GMT -5
Schiff has been on TV more often than almost any member of Congress over the past 3 years. It doesn't mean people were watching or paying attention to him. Do you remember the name of the last used car salesman you saw on TV? I would define someone who doesn’t know who Adam Schiff is as a “low info voter”. What’s crazy is that it was Jeopardy contestants. I assume they’re more informed than the average Joe on the street...
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2020 9:51:27 GMT -5
It doesn't mean people were watching or paying attention to him. Do you remember the name of the last used car salesman you saw on TV? I would define someone who doesn’t know who Adam Schiff is as a “low info voter”. What’s crazy is that it was Jeopardy contestants. I assume they’re more informed than the average Joe on the street... Maybe you're making bad assumptions as to people's priorities. I'd guess that following political theater is not high on the list for a lot of people.
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Post by soulflower on Jan 16, 2020 9:59:49 GMT -5
I would define someone who doesn’t know who Adam Schiff is as a “low info voter”. What’s crazy is that it was Jeopardy contestants. I assume they’re more informed than the average Joe on the street... Maybe you're making bad assumptions as to people's priorities. I'd guess that following political theater is not high on the list for a lot of people. That’s the point of the Vanity Fair article at the top of the Thread
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2020 10:30:42 GMT -5
Maybe you're making bad assumptions as to people's priorities. I'd guess that following political theater is not high on the list for a lot of people. That’s the point of the Vanity Fair article at the top of the Thread If the government wasn't such a dog and pony show then you'd have a point. Otherwise this is boring political theater that only nerds care about on internet forums. Oh wait...
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Post by Evil Yoda on Jan 16, 2020 10:35:45 GMT -5
The folks in Wisconsin may not agree with your needs "assessment", as they seem to keep returning the state legislature, the group responsible for this law, to Republican control. Are they, really? Or are the Republicans stealing it? We have seen that the modern Republican isn't very ethical. How far back does that go, one wonders?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2020 10:37:02 GMT -5
The folks in Wisconsin may not agree with your needs "assessment", as they seem to keep returning the state legislature, the group responsible for this law, to Republican control. Are they, really? Or are the Republicans stealing it? We have seen that the modern Republican isn't very ethical. How far back does that go, one wonders? Just keep making it up as you go, EY.
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Post by soulflower on Jan 16, 2020 13:20:21 GMT -5
Another example of why I think Personality matters more than Policy in National elections
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2020 13:25:25 GMT -5
Another example of why I think Personality matters more than Policy in National elections soulflower, do you have any idea how much money you would be worth if you could reliably figure out what passes for the American psyche? I'm not sure they even have a number for that.
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Post by palealeman on Jan 16, 2020 13:55:17 GMT -5
It's a little early in the election cycle to start with the excuse making. Nah. Barring a miracle/disaster (depending on one’s perspective) Trump will likely win again. Democrats managing expectations is probably good for the country. They didn’t last time, Hillary lost, and the low-information half the country lost its mind. Why would the low information half of the country lose its mind when its candidate won?
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Post by pickle20 on Jan 16, 2020 14:00:23 GMT -5
Nah. Barring a miracle/disaster (depending on one’s perspective) Trump will likely win again. Democrats managing expectations is probably good for the country. They didn’t last time, Hillary lost, and the low-information half the country lost its mind. Why would the low information half of the country lose its mind when its candidate won? Exactly. Educated voters tend to vote Democrat. www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2018/11/education-gap-explains-american-politics/575113/
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Post by palealeman on Jan 16, 2020 14:01:00 GMT -5
No, it isn't. Wisconsin electoral law requires voters to confirm their registration within 30 days of a mailing that is sent to the registered voter's address of record. Apparently, some 200,000 voters have not returned this confirmation. The three Republicans on the Wisconsin election board have sued, saying that the law is clear and that failure to return the cars requires that the voter be removed from the rolls. The three Democrats have counter-sued, saying that Wisconsin should wait till after the election. The law itself is not being contested; no return registration confirmation, no voter registration is valid. Registration can be initiated right up to election day, so if a record is incorrectly dropped, it can be reinstated easily. There is nothing in the link that says a particular group was targeted. That a particular group may suffer a bigger impact is not the result of the process, nor an indication of targeting. There are clearly a lot of low-information voters who don’t understand Wisconsin law. Yes, there are, which is why I'm surprised that the Republican members of the Board would sue to have their Republican voters removed.
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Post by palealeman on Jan 16, 2020 14:03:39 GMT -5
Schiff has been on TV more often than almost any member of Congress over the past 3 years. It doesn't mean people were watching or paying attention to him. Do you remember the name of the last used car salesman you saw on TV? Richard Nixon?
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Post by Evil Yoda on Jan 16, 2020 14:08:26 GMT -5
Just keep making it up as you go, EY. Your unquestioning faith in the Republicans would be touching if they weren't awful.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2020 14:11:41 GMT -5
Just keep making it up as you go, EY. Your unquestioning faith in the Republicans would be touching if they weren't awful. As is your blind hatred of all things Republican simply because they don't agree with you.
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Post by Evil Yoda on Jan 16, 2020 14:14:50 GMT -5
As is your blind hatred of all things Republican simply because they don't agree with you. That I can live with - and have lived with. It is their toadying to Trump, who is a terrible president, terrible human being, and criminal, that has pushed me disdain into active dislike. Could be my loathing will ebb when Trump is gone. Although their track record for choosing poor leaders isn't good. They are 0-2 in recent presidents, and let's not forget they gave the country Nixon. And Joe McCarthy. And Strom Thurmond. And Trent Lott. And Jesse Helms...
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Post by zenwalk on Jan 16, 2020 14:23:15 GMT -5
“Like, I’ll Tune In When There’s Two Weeks Left”: Why Trump Has a Huge Advantage Over Dems With Low-Information Voters Will the split between highly engaged versus less engaged voters benefit Trump again in 2020? Vanity Fair:
“ There are plenty of divisions in our conventional wisdom—insider versus outsider, progressive versus moderate, young versus old—but one of the biggest splits in American politics is simply between those who follow politics closely and those who do not.
It’s a split that maps, if not perfectly, onto the gap that emerged between college and non-college educated voters in 2016. The latter set are often low-information voters who view politicians and media with contempt, deciding to sit elections out. Trump has exploited them to powerful effect. The president has made politics about culture—not just policy. He found a way to attract new voters, particularly rural and non-college educated whites who previously thumbed their nose at conventional politics. Because he’s a pure attention merchant, he doesn’t care what screen he appears on, as long he is there. Because he lacks an ounce of shame, it all works, with or without the blessing of the legacy press.
None of the above can be said for Democrats, who care habitually about the good graces of the national press, and who don’t see politics as a subspecies of the entertainment business. Democrats happen to believe in facts and institutions—and yes, they would like a cable contract when the campaign is over, thank you very much. But to Trump’s great advantage, the mainstream press is where many of the fights for the Democratic nomination are being waged: on cable news, on Twitter, and in the prestige media.
As much as Democrats and the press like to blame ideological and partisan bubbles for our broken political culture—Facebook! Fox News!—their pieties usually don’t include the fact that political media culture is a bubble of its own, a cocoon of college-educated and left-leaning professionals who read the same things, watch the same shows, and liked your last tweet about Lizzo. In this world, the inside game is everything. Topics like wine caves, pay-fors, court packing, white privilege, and Iowa’s role in the nomination process have become topics of profound consequence in the race. The political media blob tumbles forward every day on the assumption that people are aware of these story lines and characters, that voters are tuning in, when many probably can’t tell you what channel this thing is on.” www.vanityfair.com/news/2020/01/why-trump-has-huge-advantage-over-democrats-low-information-votersBeen saying this for years. The GOP depends and exploits ignorance and superstition. What else explains the disconnect between reality and Trump supporters?
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Post by guido2 on Jan 16, 2020 14:44:28 GMT -5
Another example of why I think Personality matters more than Policy in National elections Yeah sure and wow. And people think using a caucus and not primary voting is a good thing? I couldn't believe listening to NPR about that and one speaker said they 'thought it great that these people were actually debating and 'switching sides' because of it. So tell me....at least in that state....some dimwit that flip flops so drastically will dictate who I should vote for. That's democracy? Sounds more like an extension of the Congress......cause 'they' know better. smh.
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Post by guido2 on Jan 16, 2020 14:49:16 GMT -5
“Like, I’ll Tune In When There’s Two Weeks Left”: Why Trump Has a Huge Advantage Over Dems With Low-Information Voters Will the split between highly engaged versus less engaged voters benefit Trump again in 2020? Vanity Fair:
“ There are plenty of divisions in our conventional wisdom—insider versus outsider, progressive versus moderate, young versus old—but one of the biggest splits in American politics is simply between those who follow politics closely and those who do not.
It’s a split that maps, if not perfectly, onto the gap that emerged between college and non-college educated voters in 2016. The latter set are often low-information voters who view politicians and media with contempt, deciding to sit elections out. Trump has exploited them to powerful effect. The president has made politics about culture—not just policy. He found a way to attract new voters, particularly rural and non-college educated whites who previously thumbed their nose at conventional politics. Because he’s a pure attention merchant, he doesn’t care what screen he appears on, as long he is there. Because he lacks an ounce of shame, it all works, with or without the blessing of the legacy press.
None of the above can be said for Democrats, who care habitually about the good graces of the national press, and who don’t see politics as a subspecies of the entertainment business. Democrats happen to believe in facts and institutions—and yes, they would like a cable contract when the campaign is over, thank you very much. But to Trump’s great advantage, the mainstream press is where many of the fights for the Democratic nomination are being waged: on cable news, on Twitter, and in the prestige media.
As much as Democrats and the press like to blame ideological and partisan bubbles for our broken political culture—Facebook! Fox News!—their pieties usually don’t include the fact that political media culture is a bubble of its own, a cocoon of college-educated and left-leaning professionals who read the same things, watch the same shows, and liked your last tweet about Lizzo. In this world, the inside game is everything. Topics like wine caves, pay-fors, court packing, white privilege, and Iowa’s role in the nomination process have become topics of profound consequence in the race. The political media blob tumbles forward every day on the assumption that people are aware of these story lines and characters, that voters are tuning in, when many probably can’t tell you what channel this thing is on.” www.vanityfair.com/news/2020/01/why-trump-has-huge-advantage-over-democrats-low-information-votersBeen saying this for years. The GOP depends and exploits ignorance and superstition. What else explains the disconnect between reality and Trump supporters? Hate to say it zen the dems do their fair share of exploitation by depending on people that expect things to be handed to them, that if you are a certain group laws shouldn't apply or be minimized and that regardless of your ax you want to grind that you are correct and it is NOT your fault. Face it the GOP and the Dems are different sides of the same coin.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2020 15:40:09 GMT -5
As is your blind hatred of all things Republican simply because they don't agree with you. That I can live with - and have lived with. It is their toadying to Trump, who is a terrible president, terrible human being, and criminal, that has pushed me disdain into active dislike. Could be my loathing will ebb when Trump is gone. Although their track record for choosing poor leaders isn't good. They are 0-2 in recent presidents, and let's not forget they gave the country Nixon. And Joe McCarthy. And Strom Thurmond. And Trent Lott. And Jesse Helms... Do you really want to go down such a list. I'm sure Robert Byrd, George Wallace, LBJ would all like to weigh in.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2020 15:41:20 GMT -5
Been saying this for years. The GOP depends and exploits ignorance and superstition. What else explains the disconnect between reality and Trump supporters? Hate to say it zen the dems do their fair share of exploitation by depending on people that expect things to be handed to them, that if you are a certain group laws shouldn't apply or be minimized and that regardless of your ax you want to grind that you are correct and it is NOT your fault. Face it the GOP and the Dems are different sides of the same coin. Which is what I have been saying for years...and the coin is a slug.
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Post by Evil Yoda on Jan 16, 2020 15:44:54 GMT -5
Do you really want to go down such a list. I'm sure Robert Byrd, George Wallace, LBJ would all like to weigh in. No, we can stop at presidents. The Dems have nothing as bad as Nixon, Bush (43) or Trump. Nothing. At. All.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2020 15:49:08 GMT -5
Do you really want to go down such a list. I'm sure Robert Byrd, George Wallace, LBJ would all like to weigh in. No, we can stop at presidents. The Dems have nothing as bad as Nixon, Bush (43) or Trump. Nothing. At. All. I guess you forgot about the guy with the extra judicial kill lists, going after whistle blowers, domestic spying, attacking a country without congressional approval, and caging children. What was his name again?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 16, 2020 15:49:16 GMT -5
Do you really want to go down such a list. I'm sure Robert Byrd, George Wallace, LBJ would all like to weigh in. No, we can stop at presidents. The Dems have nothing as bad as Nixon, Bush (43) or Trump. Nothing. At. All. Carter is arguably the worst President in US history. Clinton was not to be trusted and Obama was as divisive as Trump.
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Post by Evil Yoda on Jan 16, 2020 15:50:42 GMT -5
No, we can stop at presidents. The Dems have nothing as bad as Nixon, Bush (43) or Trump. Nothing. At. All. I guess you forgot about the guy with the extra judicial kill lists, going after whistle blowers, domestic spying, attacking a country without congressional approval, and caging children. What was his name again? No, I mentioned Bush and Trump. Obama did those things, but those two did more and worse, which means that, bad as he was, he was less bad than them.
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Post by Evil Yoda on Jan 16, 2020 15:53:04 GMT -5
No, we can stop at presidents. The Dems have nothing as bad as Nixon, Bush (43) or Trump. Nothing. At. All. Carter is arguably the worst President in US history. Clinton was not to be trusted and Obama was as divisive as Trump. Carter was at least well-meaning. And as soon as 43 was elected he wasn't the worst. Then the Pubs doubled down on that with Trump. And even in terms of honesty Carter wasn't worse than Nixon. Nor was Clinton, although his personal life didn't bear close scrutiny and he probably peddled influence. But still not worse than being impeached. Trump has been. Nixon would have been. Was Obama as divisive as Trump? That's hard to say. The TEA Party arose during his presidency, and those nuts had a great deal to do with divisiveness.
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